ABF crank sensor will it work with ITBs?

Hey,

I been reading up but I think I confused myself now, Could anyone confirm if I can use the standard ABF crank sensor with ITBS?

Stolen from another thread

ABF = Hall. Wired just like a KR 16v/8v digi dizzy.
You need Gnd (pin 1), Signal return (pin2) and 12/5v (pin 3) to run.
Noise shield is tapped from pin 1.

1.8T and VR6 = VR trigger on pins 2 (ECU vr+ and 3 (ECU vr-). Pin 1 on these is a noise shield only shares no connection to pins 2 and 3.

 

The issue with ABFs & TBs is something to do with another sensor IIRC.

 

abf ecu uses tps, air temp and a map sensor? (i think?)
tps and airtemp not problems, nor should be map by joining the bodies together on vacuum side

 

Using the crank sensor will work, but it depends on the ECU you are going to use, standard Digi management will not run optimum and will defo need a Eprom burning to your engine spec before you could drive it.

 

Cheers its an old DTA E48 ecu

 

I think im still confused on this one, what is the difference between the two?

 

Hall sensors are three wire sensors, they are GND, power (5v or 12v) and signal. The output signal is a square wave, 0v low and 5v or 12v high.

VR sensors are 2 wire, they require no power, both wires go to the ECU. The output signal is like a saw tooth, the amplitude varies with the speed of the toothed wheel, can be a couple of volts at idle and hundreds at high rpms. The size of the signal also depends on the distance of the sensor from the wheel, too close and massive voltages are made that can cause damage.

Hall sensor set ups are more expensive - which is why most production vehicles don't use them. However the hardware and software required to process the signal is more complicated, to decipher the signal when it is small at low rpms, but not damage the ECU when high volts come in at high rpms.

You should always use whichever sensor your ECU is designed for, megasquirt causes confusion because the board can be built either way, by changing some components. I used an E48 ecu many moons ago and i'm pretty sure it works with a VR sensor - most aftermarket ecus are like this. The benefit of not using megasquirt though is that you can pick up the phone and speak to someone (Alan Warburton at DTA has been quite helpful for me in the past) rather than sifting through the internet trying to find answers.

Mike

 

Great info there cheers Mike,

I spoke to someone at DTA on Friday but I wasn't armed with much info so all I asked was could I use a mk3 16v golf abf crank sensor with the E48, to which he replied "yes"

Good I though, anyway spoke to Stealth racing about booking it in for a mapping and asked the same question and he said the VR6 one works.

So I'm more confused now.

I fitted a brand new ABF one before I built the engine not knowing other wise about the vr6 version.

 

Bit more food for thought

This doc shows a good example of the saw effect you mention above Mike

http://www.dtafast.co.uk/Downloads/Manuals/E48 and P8 Manual.pdf

This wiring diagram shows only two types of sensors VR and Marelli

http://www.dtafast.co.uk/Downloads/Wiring_Diagrams/E48 Wiring Diagram.pdf

So it looks like the E48 will only work on the Variable Reluctance Speed Sensor (VR) not the Hall. I'll call DTA Monday to double check VR/Hall too

so will a VR6 crank sensor fit the abf block? also it looks like its still a 3 pin plug?

The first comment I copied sayes only two pins are used

 

well it wont work then, only reluctors work on dta

 

Thanks Bill, I didnt get a name of the bloke I spoke to at DTA

 

allan is the main man.
@ home i have the part number of the sensor which fits as a replacement for abf hall one.

i'll post its part number when i get home

 

i use a a vr6 sensor in my abf.

 

Cheers

 

ABF reluctor sensor part number for you: 021 907 319B

 

Excellent Thanks Bill, I'll get a price from VW in the morning

I'll check what cars use them as well for future ref

 

fits a golf, golf cab, passat, vento

only fits engine code AEK which is a 1.6L

021 907 319 B 85.65+vat


This is a VR6 crank sensor 021 906 433 C 75.50+vat

 

Just to add some more info to this, I tried this part and it works

part number 021 906 433 C VR6 Crank sensor
Bosch part number 0261 210 108 (563) -4

plug part number 171 906 230 (white plug) differnt to the abf connector

Thanks for the help everyone