Brake pads for track cars. Suggestions and feedback.

I know they have changed the compound of their pads in the last two or so years just for this reason and say that it should not happen any more. I would be interested if anyone has any experience to contrary, ie after 2010 pads.

 

Greens should have a bit more heat resistance than standard and are not that aggressive to minimise the rear braking effort - thats all I was thinking

 

should... lol

They bite well from cold, they did stop me faster, but their working heat range seems far too low for track.

 

Going off topic of brakes i know but you mentioned about changing from r888s and finding something better, what do you use now out of interest and in what ways are they better, ie performance,wear,cost etc?

 

Don't know if they were before or after 2010 pads - could have been old stock. A mate of mine had a set fall apart on his MGB in 2011, and he doesn't drive very hard.

 

I suppose so. They are nearly twice the price of DS2500/DS3000's....

Mine have done:
1 x full testday @ Snett (very hard on brakes)
1 x Quali @ Snett
2 x race @ Snett
2 x 20 mins trackday sessions @ Brands
1 x Quali @ Brands GP
2 x Race @ Brands GP

I still have a good chunk of (usable) pad left, and the disc is in great condition. I have managed to keep mine quite cool I think
Braking performance is incredible (I dont think I could have stronger brakes on the car) but modulation is not as good. I chose them for the strong initial bite to overcome the crappy Mk1 pedal.

As you say, those RS29's could be the ones to go for, although they are over 220 I think..? I fancied a set, but I couldn't get them in time....
What calipers are you using (sorry if I missed that)?

 

I think everyone here is aware of this but one thing to bear in mind is that a lot of high performance pads may not suite regular road driving. For instance, DS3000 go cold on the motorway and the initial pedal feeling can be quite numb when you 1st get on the brakes. Not what you'd want in an emergency.

Gurds

 

Regarding DS3000s, that would depend on type of car though.
I would suspect an 850kg vehicle w/o ABS + electronic bias, stopping suddenly from 70mph, after a long cruise, would struggle to heat the pads to the 150C friction threshold, than a 1185kg vehicle with full electronic aids and larger brake suface area.

 

Great debate this, really interesting thread.

I'll put my twopence-worth in to bump the thread.

I have been running a stripped, but pretty standard 1997 Mk3 16V for a couple of years now. Lots of trackdays using sets of APEC pads and standard discs (w. braided hoses and Super Blue fluid). Tyre-wise I run 888s dry and T1-Rs wet - both on 15" rims. A number of people commented on how good my brakes must be and were surprised in and out of the car to find they were so close to standard and with 30 pads to-boot.

At Rockingham in June this year, the morning they were great, but the afternoon they went off - big time. So much so, the pedal had even more travel than normal, and I toned it down.

So, on advice of an instructor I'd booked for Blyton park, I replaced discs all round, flushed a good 2L of RBF600 fluid through the pipes and put DS2500s on the rear and DS3000s on the front. The drive to the track was fun because the pedal felt incredibly good, but obviously I needed to bed the pads in - which I duly did.

Anyway, that one day at Blyton (with an instructor having me stamp on the brakes all day) I killed those DS3000s. The pedal travel was terrible by the end of the day. However, I did a lot of laps, often coming in with blue discs and once even smoking brakes. By the way, the standard discs are as-new.

The moral of this story is as everyone knows brake feel, wear and behaviour is totally individual.

Right, I'm off to the 'Ring and Spa next week with my Mintex F-series on the front and the 2500s on the rear. I'll report back the week after next. If you're there, look me up, the car is Black and not very fast - though that's the driver's fault - not the car!

Cheers all.

 

Great thread Nige. I will need new pads when the mk2 re-surfaces.

 

Brake pad info and feedback very useful

 

I strongly suggest you look at some form of Ducting. I`d also like to suggest, without meaning it disrespectfully, that you look at your on-track braking technique. A lot of people brake for too long and not hard enough. When I started trackdaying, I often got the brakes far too hot. I was braking far too often and not hard enough. Once I braked harder, for less time, I didn`t get them anywhere near as hot.

Gary, I`m sure you tried Pagids once, said they were great, but a failed wheelbearing worn them wedge shaped in a day ?


I`ll be getting a set of CL6E`s after New Year for the Golf in 2013. Obviously I`ll report back

 

Where are you gents buying your pads?

I'm airing towards EBC yellowstuff but I've had real bad experience years before with greenstuff & there discs.
I'm currently running G60 corrado setup on front with plain Brembo discs and VW pads... Pads have lasted approx 800miles with 360miles purely on track.

 

Nige - rs19/29 on Pooks recomendation, vgood pads

 

I have had some brilliant results from Endless brake pads on the Jaguar, they are good from cold, gentle on the discs and only @5mm of wear during an entire 24hr race I.e 109 laps of the Nurburgring.

I am going to trial them in a Mk2 by fabricating them from a different back plate. I think it will solve the big problem of pedal travel caused by the pads wearing tapered.

 

Having been a Ferrodo DS3000 user up to this point with my Mk2 16v Championship car, I'll be trying Tarox 116 compound to see how good they are. I won a set at the end of year bash this year as Tarox sponsor the championship; Specs are as follows:

TAROX 116

Coefficient of friction
Hot = 0.53
.Normal = 0.47



FERRODO DS3000

Coefficient of friction
Hot = 0.52
.Normal = 0.47


Very similar specs.. Maybe we should start a chart with relevant information on popular pads, with Friction and temp data...?

 

Out of interest have you been using the DS3000s in front and rear or front only. If front only what do you use in the rear??

 

I had Performance Friction 97`s in my 944 Turbo, superb. I used ATE Blue fluid.

From cold a slight hesitation but once they had a tad of heat in them they were faultless.

The only pads I have used where steady braking for a given pedal pressure the grip increased so you ended up easing off.

Dreadful on your wheels though (at night you can see the sparks) but will wear out discs and still have a decent life in them.

On my ABF`d Mk1 I have DS2500`s on 256mm discs with VX calipers and Motul 600 fluid. 5 track days so far and half worn, no fade, slight hesitation from cold but with a bit of heat they are faultless. I`m happy with them.

I`m inclined to agree but I admit I`m no Schumacher. One short sharp prod and smooth and even corner entry speed is key. Toasting DS3000`s is surprising.

 

Just back in the land of the living the past few days - sorry for not responding.

Nige, Hilux, believe me I agree with you. But this instructor had me absolutely nailing the brakes and they were long sessions out on track 35-45 mins each.

In any case, I said I'd report back on the Mintex pads, just a little later than planned due to health issues (not car/braking induced!)

For me, and I emphasise this, the pads are absolutely awesome. Wear on disc and pad is very good, but braking is truly awesome. The car was really excellent at the 'ring and Spa (where I changed by 888GGs for a set of Federal RSRs and was pretty impressed). I was catching up with some decent machinery on the brakes on the tighter corners - which was a lot of fun. The remaining issue I have with the brakes now is with pedal travel and feel. Partially that is ABS, and on another thread http://www.clubgti.com/showthread.php?261095-Brake-pedal-feel-and-travel the guys on this forum are giving me some invaluable information on various options for fixing this on a budget.

Perhaps not for everyone's tastes because of the corrosive nature of the brake dust and expense over DSs etc. but I rate these Mintex pads and will be buying them again. Having said that, with the use the car gets, that may not be until autumn this year.

Unfortunately I'm a software engineer not a real engineer, so I can't give you any data whatsoever. Just my personal experience - which so far has been great.

If anyone is at Bedford with Easytrack 26th April, give us a shout - I'm in a black Mk3 and my buddy is in a white Pug 205 <spit>

 

Which compound ian? Need something with good bite from cold for sprinting.

Thanks