Camber & Toe adjustment tips

Discussion in 'Chassis' started by Finite, Jan 20, 2016.

  1. Finite

    Finite Paid Member Paid Member

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2004
    Likes Received:
    255
    Location:
    Northamptonshire
    How do you do yours? Because it seems to be pure guess work if you have to jack up and remove the wheel/refit.

    I should say with minimal equipment/outlay.
     
    Last edited: Jan 21, 2016
  2. Tristan

    Tristan Paid Member Paid Member

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2006
    Likes Received:
    1,205
    Location:
    Southern IRELAND
    Finite likes this.
  3. pigbladder Forum Addict

    Joined:
    Oct 22, 2003
    Likes Received:
    108
    Location:
    cambridge , uk
    mitlom, Nige and Finite like this.
  4. Finite

    Finite Paid Member Paid Member

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2004
    Likes Received:
    255
    Location:
    Northamptonshire
    Cheers guys you've both given me ideas there for both parts :thumbup: I'll have to look out for one of those digital angle finders and maybe the old mahogany shelf I saved will pass for the plank.

    I'm using the between 2 levels (2ft with standoffs & 3ft) with vernier calipers and calculation method at the moment. Using the whole length of 2ft levels 595mm works out quite nicely 1mm = 010' ish.

    Also you've reminded me that I have a freebie magnetic boat level somewhere. Maybe I can put some calibration marks on it for the adjustment part. I think I need to knock up something to give me a bit of leverage on the hub so the strut bolts can stay fairly tight.
     
  5. Tristan

    Tristan Paid Member Paid Member

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2006
    Likes Received:
    1,205
    Location:
    Southern IRELAND
    I used to use the magnet , but unless you can get it onto the disc through the spokes , its not that easy . Handy for quick checks though .
     
  6. pigbladder Forum Addict

    Joined:
    Oct 22, 2003
    Likes Received:
    108
    Location:
    cambridge , uk
    depending on the wheel you can sometimes push the magnet thingy against where the center badge would fit , if not get a flat bit of bar and stick it to that
     
  7. rubjonny

    rubjonny Administrator Staff Member Admin

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2003
    Likes Received:
    3,298
    Location:
    Bracknell
    my way was to take a wheel off then put a jack under the balljoint and lower it till that side is at ride height, then make the adjustments. On a MK1 this is easy as it has the bolt with the cam adjustment so you just turn it then lock down. mk2 much harder as its just an oversize hole, so its a case of get some kind of pry bar and lever between shock and bearing carrier till adjustment is achieved then crank down the bolts. if you have 4 hands it would be much easier :lol:

    luckily wsince mine is now wide track to get 1.5 -ve I had to set both to the max -ve adjustment possible so not quite as hard a job as it could have been...

    edit: oh and measured with one of those ebay special magnetic gauges stuck to the hub, may not be the most accurate but you can at least get the same measurement both sides
     
    Last edited: Jan 21, 2016
  8. Nige

    Nige Paid Member Paid Member

    Joined:
    Dec 12, 2006
    Likes Received:
    2,138
    Same as above.

    Measure Camber when on ground.

    Jack up and remove wheel, measure camber, it will be different to when it`s on the floor, just note by how much.

    Adjust to target camber, allowing extra for difference between camber on ground and camber in the air.
     
    JTechPerformance likes this.
  9. Finite

    Finite Paid Member Paid Member

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2004
    Likes Received:
    255
    Location:
    Northamptonshire
    One problem I've got is the drive is all over the place, but the garage where the checks are done is too narrow to work in.

    I haven't had a chance to try adjusting the camber with this yet, but the next version needs longer bolts.

    [​IMG]

    I've moved onto toe adjustment now as it was wildly out. Does anyone have a guide figure to what a tie rod adjustment adds to the toe?

    I've found a No.6 SWA cleat bolts nicely onto the tie rod to give a reference point for measurements against the tie rod end lock nut. What's not so good is the offside steering rack boot is damaged and the inner clip looks like it rusted through some time ago.
     
    Last edited: Jan 21, 2016
  10. rubjonny

    rubjonny Administrator Staff Member Admin

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2003
    Likes Received:
    3,298
    Location:
    Bracknell
  11. Finite

    Finite Paid Member Paid Member

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2004
    Likes Received:
    255
    Location:
    Northamptonshire
    All good. I wasn't very clear, but what I'm looking for is a rough guide to adjustments like the made up figures below.

    +1mm on the tie rod = +042' on the total toe

    Halfway through adjusting both sides last night I realised that the adjustment figures off of the rim edges would be far too much on the tie rods. So I reversed what I'd done on the nearside loosing the actual change amount for that side, but it didn't turn out too bad at 056' allegedly.
     
    Last edited: Jan 22, 2016
  12. rubjonny

    rubjonny Administrator Staff Member Admin

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2003
    Likes Received:
    3,298
    Location:
    Bracknell
    ah sorry I see now, cant help there sorry :lol:
     
  13. Hilux Forum Member

    Joined:
    Aug 8, 2008
    Likes Received:
    29
    Location:
    North Herts
    I agree.

    The suspension should be level and loaded.

    I use the Sealey version (see below) - not cheap but keep it in its box and don't drop it and you`ll have it for years.

    Its very accurate as I have found the settings to be nearly spot on when the car was set up afterwards on a Hunter alignment jig. The trick is to leave it alone for a few minutes as the bubble oil is very thick thereby dampening the bubble movement and making it more accurate.

    It will also measure caster and king pin inclination should you so wish.

    [​IMG]
     
  14. blis Forum Member

    Joined:
    Dec 27, 2011
    Likes Received:
    617
    Location:
    New South Wales
    Now that is a handy tool.

    From memory my MK2 2was set up with it's a teeny bit of toe in (scrubs the outer) and a smidge of camber to bring the contact patch back toward the center on the tyre. (cant remember the actual values)

    Before I set off for an proper alignment, I eyeballed it like a race car with TOE out and camber and the car wandered all over the place.
     
  15. Finite

    Finite Paid Member Paid Member

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2004
    Likes Received:
    255
    Location:
    Northamptonshire
    Yeah theres not much caster on the Mk2. I'll try the camber advice of levelling it up and loading it when I get the new tyres on :thumbup:

    Just doing the steering rack boot and tie rod end. The boot came with no clips [:x] and the tie rod end really didn't want to come out. I could hear one of the neighbours Effing and Jeffing about the noise as I was upgrading from a 4 pound lump hammer to the 8 pound sledge in the shed :p
     
  16. Notso Swift Forum Member

    Joined:
    Jan 14, 2015
    Likes Received:
    65
    1-2mm Toe in is standard on road cars, On track you will be looking for 4-6mm toe out
     
  17. Finite

    Finite Paid Member Paid Member

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2004
    Likes Received:
    255
    Location:
    Northamptonshire
    Got the tyres on now apparently one of the wheel rims isn't straight which isn't going to help toe accuracy. One tool I want to buy is the SmartTool Digital Angle sensor at 0 or 90 it's accurate to 0.05 and most importantly has a calibration method not reliant on a reference grade surface, but given the price I've bought one of these after seeing it in the FAQ.

    [​IMG]

    It should be ideal for adjustment reference with the wheel off and I think it might be usable on the tie rod as well.

    This is my toe measuring contraption lol I level down onto the paper and measure between the marks.

    [​IMG]
     
  18. Finite

    Finite Paid Member Paid Member

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2004
    Likes Received:
    255
    Location:
    Northamptonshire
    Looking at that now I've posted it I think I can turn the narrowness of the garage into an advantage :idea:. The axle stand frames are slightly too high and levelling down affects the accuracy so I'll make some dual purpose flip down shelves to hold the level and provide a surface to mark directly. Measuring between will be a bit more difficult than across the floor, but this could be later corrected with a laser range finder.
     
  19. blis Forum Member

    Joined:
    Dec 27, 2011
    Likes Received:
    617
    Location:
    New South Wales
    On a smaller scale..

    Toe is the tricky one in closed wheel cars, you'd need to vector the toe under the car somehow.

    Caster is measured with a guide that clamps onto the hub. The side plates act as a plane to the front plates in the following pic and are fixed to the hub. Height of side plate should be same as radius of wheel.
    DSCF5003 (HD).jpg

    The side plates pivot from the side plates on bearings, camber is measured relative to the side plate. and the top plate is used to measure toe and steering angles.
    DSCF5011 (HD).jpg
     
  20. Finite

    Finite Paid Member Paid Member

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2004
    Likes Received:
    255
    Location:
    Northamptonshire
    I like that jig. Ultimately I think that is how it should be done on a large scale, wheels removed and well engineered steel stands bolted to the hubs. I've seen an American system that would be my choice as a pipe dream. The stands were about $900 a pair let alone the turn plates lol. It was shown working off of a dual RSJ jig similar to that used for Project Binky. A total waste for a road car with rubber bushings, but even so.

    For camber I rotate that yellow level 90 I'll be using the Wixey against it once I get it. The floor below needs levelling with polymer based concrete patch repair, but that's a job for the spring/summer.
     

Share This Page

  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
    Dismiss Notice