MK4 Golf Climatronic install into MK2 Golf

Discussion in 'Electrical' started by rubjonny, Aug 7, 2013.

  1. Salveno New Member

    Joined:
    Apr 2, 2018
    Likes Received:
    0
    Hi,
    My car has the drain plug yes.
    I have started the process, soon I will be at the point of no return.
    [​IMG]
     
  2. Salveno New Member

    Joined:
    Apr 2, 2018
    Likes Received:
    0
    1 hour got me this far.
    [​IMG]
     
  3. rubjonny

    rubjonny Administrator Staff Member Admin

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2003
    Likes Received:
    3,298
    Location:
    Bracknell
    good progress :)

    one thing, you have an indicator relay in the rear wiper slot 11 on the fusebox :p
     
  4. swiftkid New Member

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2007
    Likes Received:
    1
    Been reading this thread on a daily basis and finally got my controller powered up last night. As always rubjonny had been a legend helping get wiring diagrams for install in a corrado, it's a little different but most of the info still applies.

    I'll try add a few other hurdles I've had to jump tonight.

    T12a - on climatronic loom to main car harness:
    1 - grey/white - diagnostics K line, I ran it down to the connection board just in front of the dash
    2 - brn/blu - a/c on signal, rad fan control unit T14/8 (mk4) ecu connection T80/10 or T24c/14 (passat) - bin, the ECU controls the fan on MK4s so not needed if you are using original
    3 - brn - n/a
    4 - gry/blu - n/a
    5 - brn/yel - outside air temp sensor, mines in the rain tray at the moment but will relocate and mount it next to existing external air temp when engine loom comes out next
    6 - blu/blk - n/a
    7 - yel/blu - n/a
    8 - wht/grn - sunlight sensor in top of dash, haven't quite decided where this is going yet, there's a vent blank in the middle I was going to try mount it underneath
    9 - blk/wht - rad fan control unit T14/12 (mk4) a/c pressure switch (passat, early mk4) - bin, the ECU controls the fan on MK4s so not needed
    10 - blu/wht - vehicle speed signal - added a connector on and plugged it into the connector block above the fusebox with the rest of the VSS
    11 - gry - n/a
    12 - red/blu - outside temp signal to dash clocks pin T32a/26 (feeds the temperature display on the clocks) - bin, existing sensor remains

    T17a - on climatronic loom to main car harness:
    1 - blk/blu - ignition live to blower fan and control unit (25a fuse) - I used Q2 (blk/yel) which goes into the white plug that used to go into the heater control
    3 - blu/red - ecu pin 10 or 40 (mk4) n/a (passat) -
    4 - grn/brn - engine speed signal - tap into G1/11 or U1/11
    5 - blk/blu - ignition live - Q4, this powers the glove box light & supposedly the VDO gauges in the centre console
    6 - brn - earth - I just plugged this into the terminal block on drivers side
    7 - red/gry - permanent live feed - now I think this is aircon related so plan on leaving it disconnected
    8 - brn/wht - climatronic sensor common ground (for outside air temp sensor & sunlight sensor)
    9 - pur/yel - n/a
    10 - gry/blu - dash lighting, connected this to the power from the old dash lighting, there's a couple of 2 pin plugs you can pick from. Should be Q6
    11 - yel/red - n/a (late mk4, passat) a/c pressure switch pin 3 (early mk4) - as T12a/2
    12 - grn - ecu pin 10 or 41 (mk4) ecu connection T80/8 or T24c/11 compressor switch off? (passat) - as T12a/2
     
    Last edited: Jun 12, 2019
    Josh Gateh likes this.
  5. rubjonny

    rubjonny Administrator Staff Member Admin

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2003
    Likes Received:
    3,298
    Location:
    Bracknell
    So you arent going to run aircon with this? as thats what the 2 wires from the climatronic panel to the fan control module are for, rather than just fan control.

    with engine speed signal this expects a low amp ecu signal, so it wont work with the mk2 signal. If you have mk3/4 clocks with ecu signal sent thru fusebox from G1/12 then for the dash loom you can use D/6 as this is common to the rev counter pin :)

    what I did on mine was run it to the ABF ecu wire with a plug inline, leaving the mk2 coil negative to G1/12. As the ABF ECU only has the 1 aircon signal wire to a 2 pin plug, I put the old ABF ecu green/white rev counter wire into the empty slot of the aircon plug and put a mating connector on my climatronic dash harness for them both.

    T17a/3 and 12 are both feeds to tell the ECU aircon is active, if you aren't running the aircon part then neither are needed. From lots of digging about I believe the functions are:
    T17a/3 (T12/3 on main panel) - blu/red - AGU pin 10, AUM pin 40 - (A/C readiness) - 12v signal 'A/C requested' (A/C switch on)
    T17a/12 (T16b/12 on main panel) - grn or grn/gry - AGU pin 8, AUM pin 41 - (engine electronics - bi-directional) - 12v signal 'A/C OK' (all sensors report OK)

    so for a MK2/3 ECU with just 1 trigger you would want to use T17a/3. T17a/12 probably wouldn't work on a MK3 ECU, but it may work on the later ones with 2 wires. possibly.

    on the B5 passat its a little different:
    T12/2 - blk/yel - AEB pin 10 - (idle speed control/boost) - live when A/C switched ON and/or heated screen ON
    T16b/12 - blk/gry - AEB pin 8 - (engine electronics - bi-directional) - 12v signal 'A/C OK' (all sensors report OK)

    so for an earlier car T12/2 would do you, and I guess it woudl also work on a MK4 panel though when you go into VAGCOM to set the coding to passat or mk4, this might have the side affect of switching the 'ac requested' output between pins 2 or 3 on the t12 pin plug, something I haven't messed with.
     
  6. swiftkid New Member

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2007
    Likes Received:
    1
    No, I'm just using the corrado fan box like you have done. Don't need aircon so no plans to ever install it, plus it just makes my life that bit easier.

    I've had a bit of a dumb moment, I'm running an Audi A3 3.2 and the tacho doesn't actually work. I did add the pin into the ECU, think it was T121/37 or 54 same as mk4 but nothing. I've seen it flutter a couple of times but nothing more than that. Would you happen to know if, once I have a canbus convertor for the tacho I could borrow that signal? Any idea why the climate control needs speedo & tacho signals? VSS is easy enough although I've ran out of slots in the little junction box.

    As you mentioned somewhere earlier I'm stealing the blk/yel wire from old heater controller for power to the fan then tapping into stage 4 of the fan which is a wht/yel wire apparently (or the biggest wire).

    So just to dumb it down for me, the minimum to get this running is:

    T12a
    1 - grey/white - K line

    T17a
    1 - blk/blu - ignition live to blower fan and control unit (25a fuse) - I used Q2 (blk/yel)
    5 - blk/blu - ignition live, Q4
    6 - brn - earth
    10 - gry/blu - dash lighting, Q6

    Carrying on with my notes of installation, it was a right sod to fit. I don't like drilling holes in my car so I opted to cut and move the top bolt, you'll need some very stong glue as epoxy just doesn't even hold for 5 minutes. I used the mk4 core which meant that you get quick release fittings onto the heater matrix which is lovely and neat, I grabbed 2 straight connectors from an Audi TT from scrapyard as the mk4 golf has a straight and an elbow fitting.

    The lower bolt on the heater box looks to be in the same position as the mk2/corrado but its shorter so brings the heater box closer to the bulkhead. ideally the holes in the bulkhead want slotting and a spacer added to move it out and up a touch but I did neither, I may take it all back out again and make it fit better but for now I just want to drive my car!
     
    Last edited: Jun 12, 2019
  7. rubjonny

    rubjonny Administrator Staff Member Admin

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2003
    Likes Received:
    3,298
    Location:
    Bracknell
    Yeah the can-bus tacho adaptor will put the same signal out the climatronic expects, but you dont actually need it if you're not running aircon. its there so the module switches the a.c off at high rpm, and since you'll never have it switched on its no problem :lol: Mine hasnt been connected for a while, I thought the a/c signal from the module might have been messing with my abf ecu as sometimes idle went a bit funny so I disconnected the 2 pin plug I mentioned earlier which also had the rev counter signal in. made no difference either way so its been off ever since.

    Climatronic needs the speed signal to adjust for higher/lower airflow input depending on road speed I think. You could pull the speed signal out that goes to the radio, it wont be doing anything unless you have the expensive AKTIV radio or a later OEM VW unit. Again the VSS input doesnt make a massive difference, mine has been down ever since I put the 02a gearbox in! I must have bashed something while swapping the speedometer cable as I no longer get any speed/distance/mpg readings on my MFA. Yet another job to add to the list :(

    If I was to do it again I would so the same and move the studs on the box rather than drill holes, and I will do so when the next revision goes in at some point in the future. I used the same straight fittings you did, though I found they made my heater hoses bend slightly further forward than I would like so ideally need trimming down and/or using the mk4 angled fittings. Not that it really affects anything as they can still flow fine

    as you say lower stud is too short so needs a spacer on it as I mentioned in post 7. You can see in that post I also ran out of patience and just got it in there so it was finally done :lol:

    Think that covers it for the feeds, the permanent live might be required so the unit remembers settings between drives but I've not checked it with or without. The passat doesn't have this feed so certainly not needed for it to work anyway
     
  8. swiftkid New Member

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2007
    Likes Received:
    1
    Ahh yes, I didn't think of the memory aspect, will test that and report back. In hindsight I really should have started this at the start of winter not start of what is supposed to be summer so I could do things properly but hey ho. I'm also doing a teves20 upgrade at the same time which means there are wires everywhere but that's nearly done so hopefully get to reinstall everything and test it.

    Out of interest where do you get your connectors from? I've got about 6 cars worth of looms I pinch connectors from but I've used all the good ones so running a bit low. Ideally I want to get male & female connectors so I can retain the modular wiring.
     
  9. rubjonny

    rubjonny Administrator Staff Member Admin

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2003
    Likes Received:
    3,298
    Location:
    Bracknell
    when you make as many looms as I do spare connectors off salvaged looms is something you never run short of :lol:

    for bigger multi-pin connectors the mk3 golf is a great donor in scrappy theres one for the rear window switch loom to main electric window loom for junior timer pins. or if you look in the doors on mk4 golf & similar theres a 10 pin plug for the electric mirror plug which takes micro timer male and female pins. 6n polo has a 5 pin junior timer male & female plug for the mirrors.

    basically scrappy shopping around, its where i get my stocks of fuse and relay holders from as well
     
  10. Corradoman93 New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 6, 2019
    Likes Received:
    0
    Hi can someone help me. I’m using a Passat b5.5 climatronic and I don’t have t17 connector

    I can’t get the temperature *C on the left side on the display to display. (-*C) Also I can’t can’t the ac to turn on. I am currently bench testing so not connected to the car. I have used a jumper wire and grounded each relay one at a time and the radiator fan does turn on and ac clutch so the wiring is correct just the climatronic won’t activate the relays.

    The climatronic is canbus taken from a Passat b5.5 2002 and I think it was a 1.8T

    Planning to install it into a corrado but bench testing it first

    Also illuminate doesn’t work

    Missing the sunlight sensor so I need it? Don’t care running the climatronic in auto mode

    EDIT ——->>>>> solved
    https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PLXvxRq4qhhaVHr53LbVu6IaKMtvNxnUTL&si=AMKbK47ZeqsY8I0n
     
    Last edited: Dec 21, 2023
  11. rubjonny

    rubjonny Administrator Staff Member Admin

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2003
    Likes Received:
    3,298
    Location:
    Bracknell
    Climatronic wont trigger anything unless it sees all sensor inputs on ac circuit are good, since you wont have a pressure switch connected up to a nicely filled refrigerant system its not going to switch on the ac.

    for ambient temp it 12 pin plug pin 8 you want, 2nd pin of sensor is earthed in the climatronic sensor harness back to the 12 pin plug pin 9. Its connected to engine side of the harness by a grey 10 pin plug 'T10k' pin 7 and 9

    for illumination you need both ignition live and dash lights on feeds to get it lit up, it wont trigger with just lights on power. sunlight sensor 99.9% sure wont affect aircon function, but not hard to hook one up worst case somewhere, poking out one of the dash vents after trimming the plastic surround down a bit
     
  12. Corradoman93 New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 6, 2019
    Likes Received:
    0
    Edit ->> Solved https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PLXvxRq4qhhaVHr53LbVu6IaKMtvNxnUTL&si=AMKbK47ZeqsY8I0n

    Yes I know I have no gas but I was just going to use a jumper wire, but not sure what pins to jump. Does the sensor read no gas and excessive gas pressure ? I guess I just need to jump the wires to turn on low speed fan then ?

    but am I right in saying it still won’t work if I don’t have all the sensors? can I not just bypass the sunlight sensor . As it’s more for auto or eco mode? Or is that wrong?

    as for the outside temp, I have the Out side temp gauge but I don’t know what it connects to . It’s brown and yellow- connects to ? The other is brown and red which I guess connects to brown and white as a negative? ( there is no brown and yellow coming from the climatronic as it’s from a Passat, I was wonder can I repin the connection or is it internally not connected?

    i have red blue which is ignition on
    And purple which is dash lighting. When I put both to 12v I still don’t get any illumination but I’m starting to wonder is the light it’s self damaged?

    I know many questions and you haven’t been down this road before but any input would be great
     
    Last edited: Dec 21, 2023
  13. rubjonny

    rubjonny Administrator Staff Member Admin

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2003
    Likes Received:
    3,298
    Location:
    Bracknell
    I assumed it was the 3 pin pressure switch on the b5.5 which cant be jumped as it outputs a variable signal depending on system pressure, but after having a look its still got the dumb 4 pin switch. Looking at it you need to jump pins 1 & 2 to simulate 'good' pressure, other 2 pins are used to trigger one of the fan relays and have no connection to the climatronic module :)

    the sunlight sensor afaik wont affect the operation of the air conditioning, it just means the auto mode is slightly less able to maintain a 100% perfect cabin temperature. leave the plug on the loom, then worst case just stuff it somewhere out of sight but where it can still get some kind of light to it. poke out of a speaker cover or something

    for the outside temp sensor, like I said it is wired to the 12 pin plug on the climate module pin 8 for signal and pin 9 common earth. I see no reason why you cant just add the wires to yours if its not there :)

    there is no dash lighting feed on the 5.5 either, the purple wire is connected to the wiper relay and on earlier models this pin is connected to the plate lights rather than dash lighting. Again I guess this is handled by CAN-BUS, so try adding a wire to 12 pin plug pin 5 and see if it lights up

    very worst case you'll have to buy an older passat/mk4 climate panel, change coding in vagcom to passat if required and make a couple tweaks to the loom if you cant get the lights and outside temp working. possibly you can change the coding in vagcom of existing panel to disable can-bus and switch it back to dumb mode?
     
  14. rubjonny

    rubjonny Administrator Staff Member Admin

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2003
    Likes Received:
    3,298
    Location:
    Bracknell
    I've put the 5.5 diagram on my google docs, 3b3climatronic.pdf. you can check the pins vs the list at the start of my guide to see the differences, 1st one I noticed apart from the above is the aircon compressor relay trigger is on a different pin so thats first thing you'd probably have to change with older panel
     
  15. Corradoman93 New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 6, 2019
    Likes Received:
    0
    Ok first things first.. just want to say thank you (in person ..over the internet) I have a mk1 and I’ve been reading your posts for the last 5 years and your info is top notch, you solved many of my problems, so thank you for helped me over so many years.

    back to the current problem
    I followed the out side temp brown yellow and it ends Up in the dash (green plug pin 26 of 32 ) I have a wiring diagram and it says it also returns back to the climatronic but mine doesn’t and there is no pin in t12/8 . Will it works if just add a pin or does it. Need to be Re coded

    how do I change the coding in my existing panel to non can bus ?

    I pressed recirculation +econ. Wiped the codes and then read the current fault codes-
    Can bus (can’t remember the code) came up so it’s clearly not happy and I’m guess this is the major problem

    how do I read your google docs? (sorry is there a link - new to this )

    thank you again
     
  16. rubjonny

    rubjonny Administrator Staff Member Admin

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2003
    Likes Received:
    3,298
    Location:
    Bracknell
    You're very welcome :)

    I would first try to wire the outside sensor and dash lighting feeds to the pins I mention, see if the panel works as expected. For testing purposes you could just bare some wires and poke them in the back of the plugs before making a proper connection.

    My Google documents link is in my signature :)

    If you log into the older xlimatronic panel with vagcom you can change the coding from golf to Passat, I guess the same may be possible with the newer canbus type?
     
  17. rubjonny

    rubjonny Administrator Staff Member Admin

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2003
    Likes Received:
    3,298
    Location:
    Bracknell
    whats the part number on the panel you have out of interest
     
  18. Corradoman93 New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 6, 2019
    Likes Received:
    0
    I have checked all over it and there is no part number on the climatronic head unit. I took it from a 2002 maybe 2003 passat b5.5 (with 1.8T engine I think.) if that is any help

    I am going to try swap a few pins like you said. And if that doesn’t work, I’m thinking it’s a case of vcds- 19 can gateway- installation list —— and change some codes and see what happens from there... might be asking you for a screen shot of your codes and compare that two ( am I correct in thinking that’s how I would remove canbus ?) if all failing that, I will keep climatronic and add a extra (AC) button with a relay which will trigger the ac pump if it see normal refrigerant pressure and turn on the low speed fan too
     
  19. rubjonny

    rubjonny Administrator Staff Member Admin

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2003
    Likes Received:
    3,298
    Location:
    Bracknell
    ok never mind, once you get vagcom plugged in you will see the part number once you connect :)

    if adding the pins doesnt work you could just get another climatronic panel from a mk4 or earlier passat, the can-gateway is either a separate module or inside the cluster depending on age not sure even if you wired one up you could connect to it to then disable can mode on the climate panel...
     
  20. Corradoman93 New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 6, 2019
    Likes Received:
    0
    Swapping pins didn’t work :( on A5 for lights and a8 for OAT I did read the voltage in pin a8 (t12/8) and it was 5v when connected to the out side air temp I could change the voltage by warming the sensor up in my hands . So the head unit is picking up the input but ignoring it I think because it’s looking for can bus input (only my idea could be wrong)

    I connected it to vcds
    Vag no - 3B1 907 004 J
    Component - climatronic b5gp 0006
    Soft code 17000
    Shop # wsc 00028

    2 questions -
    What soft code and what climatronic head unit are you using ?

    and to change the code is it just a matter of changing 17000 to some other number? Or will that even do anything ?
     
    Last edited: Oct 10, 2019

Share This Page

  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
    Dismiss Notice