Help with a MS diagram pls!

Discussion in 'Throttle bodies & non-OEM ECUs' started by rubjonny, Mar 26, 2011.

  1. rubjonny

    rubjonny Administrator Staff Member Admin

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    I'm currently making a MK1 1.8t Megasquirt loom and I'm struggling to find the diagram I need for the spark control part. I have a nice diagram from eddie that was included with the ecu which has pin 6 (SPR4) for spark B and pin 36 for spark a, but the trouble is this was for a 3 pin coil and the one in the box is a 4 pin from a pug.

    anyone got the infos i need to make it work? cheers! it looks like its a 3 pin unit but with some kind of resistor on one of the wires (radio suppressor?) so i assume all i need to know is which of the 3 wires are which. of course there are no pin numbers on the thing, and the wires are all yellow which is very helpfull!

    it looks like zis:
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Mar 26, 2011
  2. Toyotec

    Toyotec CGTI Committee - Happy helper at large Admin

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    The MS digram that was pointed to is not the issue. You need a schematic for a Sagem coil pack. I believe this is Pin 3+ve from kl15 Pin1 spark a Pin 2 spark b and Pin 4 supply from Pin 3 for supressor capacitor.

    With this understadning you can use the diagram given with the supplied ECU and labelled loom to connect to the coil pack.

    Pin 36 (blue S5) to Pin 1 of the coil pack Pin 6 ( SPR 4) to Pin 2 of coil pack and Klemme 15 to pin 3 of coil pack. Job done.
     
    Last edited: Mar 26, 2011
  3. rubjonny

    rubjonny Administrator Staff Member Admin

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    yeah thats what i need, a diagram on how to wire the coil to the ecu. the diagram supplied for the rest of it is perfect :)

    as i say, the main issue i have is i dont know which pin is what, since there are no numbers on it anywhere.

    edit: aha! the plug is numbered 1-4, so assuming those pins are correct, i should now have all i need thanks :thumbup:

    the resistor thingy is on pin 3, so am i right to assume keinline 15 is to pin 4? also i assume by keinline 15 you mean terminal 15 circuit, i.e. coil live feed from pin 15 of the ign switch right?
     
  4. Toyotec

    Toyotec CGTI Committee - Happy helper at large Admin

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    Terminal 15 = KL15 which as you know is the black wire from the vehicle's loom, that supplies the original coil.
    Two pins on the Sagem 4 pole coil pack should be continuous ( 3 and 4). This is the supply.The suppressor is a noise filter or capacitor not resistor.

    So use the diagram which defaults to a Visteon/Bosch coil pack from a Ford product to integrate this coil.
     
  5. rubjonny

    rubjonny Administrator Staff Member Admin

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    right i see, so i can use pins 1-3, bin the suppressor and leave pin 4 unused?
     
  6. brutalmk2-16v Forum Member

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    Hi John. I'm using the same coil and here is how i connected it:

    pin 1 -> spark A
    pin 2 -> spark B
    pin 3 -> +12v switched
    pin 4 -> suppressor

    And no don't bin the suppressor. I was looking into this matter for 10 days. Best bet is to find a pug loom that uses wasted spark coil and cut off that part of the loom that goes to the coil.
     
  7. Toyotec

    Toyotec CGTI Committee - Happy helper at large Admin

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    As per brutalmk2-16v, do not bin.
    Looks like from you picture this is already there. Just simply bolt to an earth.
     
  8. brutalmk2-16v Forum Member

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    Yes i just saw that in the picture. The suppressor is that small black box
     
  9. rubjonny

    rubjonny Administrator Staff Member Admin

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    ok cool, problem is pin 3 is the suppressor, and the plug is sealed with like a glue so its definitely not been fiddled with. i could hack the glue off and swap the pins to suit as i'll be re-terminating my own wires anyway. as long as it'll definitly work thats cool, since its not for me its for someone else. if it was on my car i could just pop the pins out and swap if required but this wouldnt be so easy for the guy I'm doing it for
     
  10. brutalmk2-16v Forum Member

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    I would do it like you r saying, just swap the pins.Are all the wires yellow John?
     
  11. vw_singh Events Team Paid Member

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    Hi John, pin 3 & 4 are the same connection. They just use different pins for ease of wiring. So just power pin 4 and leave 3 with the supressor on it.

    Gurds
     
  12. Bruce T Forum Member

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    I'm glad this thread came up...I have the same same coil so it has saved me asking :thumbup:
    This is why I love this forum!
     
  13. bens_cab Forum Junkie

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    the suppresor not being there isnt a issue ive run with and without with no problems if id seen this thread earlier i could have given you the pin layout which is the same as above from brutal16v
     
  14. peterg60 CGTI Regional Co-Host - Birmingham & Midlands

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    this is the loom being built for me just wanted to know anybody running the mk4 throttle position sensor with megasquirt or do i have to use a abf throttle position sensor on the mk1 20v agu? ben you said you was using the mk4 how did u go about this
     
  15. Toyotec

    Toyotec CGTI Committee - Happy helper at large Admin

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    8 pin - 1 throttle module. Yes I will put up the config in a while.
     
  16. peterg60 CGTI Regional Co-Host - Birmingham & Midlands

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    Last edited: Mar 30, 2011
  17. bens_cab Forum Junkie

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    again the original can be used with the wire to the dash having a inline resistor then run easytherm to bring it inline
     
  18. Toyotec

    Toyotec CGTI Committee - Happy helper at large Admin

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    Hope this picture can be seen clearly.
    This is the configure for the 8-1 pin throttle module.

    [​IMG]
     
  19. tshirt2k

    tshirt2k Forum Junkie

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    Is that motor for idle control? Can it me used with ms. Obviously I mean MS2
     
  20. Toyotec

    Toyotec CGTI Committee - Happy helper at large Admin

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    Yes MS2 supports stepper motor idle control. Later VW engines fitted with M3.8.X or Simos controls had adaptive idle and thus the J338 throttle module as it is called.
     

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