Hi all, I picked up a mk2 1300 Pierburg 2E3 Golf a while back and can't get it running. Symptoms: Turn the key and the engine will turn over and over all but wont fire. If I pump the accelerator pedal, it will fire as long as I keep squirting petrol in my the pedal. If i put petrol in the carb by hand, it will run and even runs smooth. The sump is filling with petrol! and when I took the carb off, there was a puddle of petrol on the preheater! The symptoms seemed point towards fuel starvation so I put a new fuel pump and filter in and made NO difference. I changed the carb off a scrap car but made no difference. I have also replaced the carb again with a gaurenteed working carb! (I heard it run) = made no difference. I have checked the feul pump direction pipes with the Haynes manual and are correct. Can any body help as im sick of looking at it now! Thanks
When you took the carb off, did you look at the condition of the mounting flange (the rubbery bit the carb bolts down to)? If that was leaking a lot of air that should be going through the carb barrels, that may explain it, as airflow is what creates the fuel flow (except via the accelerator pump). Which carb do you really have? 2e2 has a waxstat on its front with two coolant pipe connections, 2e3 doesn't. Got any pictures? If it is a 2e3, it may have a solenoid valve on the front of it, which must have 12V when the ignition is on. If you've not got that 12V, the fuel supply to the idle outlet is cut off. There's possibly a fuse blown that feeds this and a couple of other bits. Another possible cause would be a leak in the fuel line, between tank and pump. Because there is below-atmospheric pressure in this line when the engine is running, if it can suck air instead of fuel, it will (air being lighter and less viscous).
Thanks EZ Pete, From your description of the two carbs, i must have the 2E2 as i have the two coolant pipes at the drivers' side of the carb. The mounting flange is in good condition, so no leaks there. Something like a blown fuse sounds like a posible cause to me,but Ive checked all the fuses in fuse box and are all good so I dont know. I dont think its the carb itself but must be something to do with the carb, like wireing or something. I can post a picture of the carb if its a help, ill sort it out tomorrow for you. Bear in mind that petrol is entering the oil...that is very bad!
Thanks EZ Pete, The carb mount is in good condition and definatelly no leaks there. By your description carbs, I must have the 2e2 because it has the two coolant pipes on the left hand side of the carb. I dont think its a leak in the fuel line because if i disconnect the pipe off the fuel pump, there is a serious suply of fuel! It would surely be able to run? Can you explain the pudle of petrol in the inlet manifold? or the petrol in the sump? thanks again
No; both 2e2s and 2e3s have the coolant pipes to the autochoke on the side of the carb. Only the 2e2 has two more pipes going to the waxstat on the front of the carb. I'll do a quick search and find you a picture of the 2e3, which I suspect you have.
Pic of front of 2e3, courtesy of member Gtimadman: The fuel cutoff solenoid I mentioned earlier is just to the left of the textbox labelled 'B'. Does your carb look like this one? Alternatively, if you really do have a 2e2, you'll see something like this on the driver's side of the carb (pic by gazmacuk):
Hey EZ Pete, As you suspected, I do infact have a 2E3! It also has 12v at that solenoid constantly when the ignition is on. Ill take some pictures and post them incase you can spot anything out of the ordinary. Thanks
Ah, good pics Dave. Seems I was confused about the way the carb sits when I labelled Gtimadman's 2e3 pic as the 'front' view, when in fact it showed the back. Having established that you have a 2e3, definitely, I'm going to suggest that you forget about it for a little while and check out the ignition side of things. Couple of reasons for this. 1. You know this carb was running on another engine, and you've established that the fuel cutoff solenoid is getting the necessary voltage to allow it to run. 2. To quote an oft-quoted line "Most carb faults are ignition faults". In this case, the very fact that you're getting build-ups of petrol in manifold etc. without much success at starting it/running it suggests to me that the petrol isn't getting ignited properly. Have you had a look at the spark plugs, distributor cap and rotor arm? Also could be a dodgy HT lead or two, or even a hall-sender wiring prob, but start with the cheapest bits first if you haven't already ruled them out as recent/good-condition/new. It could be a blocked idle jet or faulty choke component on the carb, if the spark is definitely good. Are you aware, BTW, that the 2e3 choke system is semi-automatic, not fully-automatic; requiring a pedal-press-to-the-floor (then complete release) prior to cranking when starting from cold to set the choke?
I put a new rotor arm and a new cap on when i got it. i havn't looked at the plug sparking but if I press the accel pedal a few times before starting ie. using the semi-choke to squirt petrol in, it will start and run for maybe 3-4 seconds before the it will cut out from starvation. It runs pretty smooth and sounds well so I dont really think its a spark fault... To me, its seems as if there is some kind of cut-off valve on the fuel line in the carb that isn't opening which is starving the carb and the pressurised petrol is making its way into the manifold and filling the sump....or something like that. Is this giving you the same head ache i have?!?!?! Cheers
Well there is a fuel cutoff valve, but it is getting the 12V it needs. It's possible that it isn't working though. If you get someone else to switch the ignition on and off a few times while you listen at the back of the carb, you should be able to hear the solenoid clicking back and forth, I'd imagine. Ah, one more thing... Is there a brown earth/ground wire coming off the carb, going to somewhere on the engine? If that were unconnected or broken, none of the carb electrics will be working. I'm not sure on the 2e3 where this connection is usually made (maybe via the carb mounting bolts? on the 2e2 these don't ground it as they only go into the rubber of the mounting flange), but check that you have 0 Ohms or very close to it between carb body and battery negative (ignition off while testing this). What's that brown wire that goes into a bit of terminal block, and comes out the other side as a black wire in the picture of post #10? Can't see where those wires are going to/from. If that checks out OK, test your choke pulldown unit (and check its vacuum pipes). If that is completely failed it might explain your trouble. You'd be getting petrol but no air if that isn't doing its job at all. There's a thread in the FAQ section on how to test this bit. It's basically the same on 2e2s and 2e3s.
That brown/black connected wire is the earth to the carb connected to the head. I've been told before that the earth is important so I connected a jump lead from the batery terminal straight to the body of the carb.....made no difference. Ill get my meter out though and check the resistance between the batery and the carb to be sure to be sure. I can hear a click when I turn the key but ill make sure that its that solenoid working correctly. Ive not tested the choke pulldown unit but i have replaced the vacuum pipes alredy. Ill look for that thread. Thanks again
Ok, ive made some progress!! I inspected the choke pull-down unit and it is defective.it wouldnt spring close atall. When I closed the choke butterfly, it started and ran. Initially it would not idle so i had to keep the revs up to stop it cutting out. When it warmed up a bit,it started to idle. I drove it half a mile down the road and the oil light came on with a buzzer so petrol is still filling the sump. It feels so good to be finally getting somewhere! Oh and the CD player desided to start working too!
I forgot to mention... ...on the 2e3, with its semi-automatic choke, you'll need to 'set' it as described earlier before testing the pulldown unit. In other words, don't expect the choke-flap to be in its fully-closed, ready-for-cold-start position unless you've done the accel-pedal to the floor then release first (assuming the engine is cold). I think this is in the Owners Manual, if your car still has one of those. The mechanism by which this setting is achieved is a cunning little set of 'widgets' just on the carb-body side of the autochoke housing. I looked into this stuff on this thread, which may be helpful to you (see post #9 onward especially). It might be that these little springs etc. on yours are all clogged up and impeding the correct operation of the autochoke. First thing to do if you do sort it out is probably an oil change! Oh, and have you looked at the spark plugs yet? Oh, and I do happen to have a spare, working pulldown if that still seems broken when you've tested it again. It only opens the choke btw, can't close it.
