88 Monza valver minted up... 180bhp/155lb/ft ABF FTW

Looking good, always great to see an ABF on ITBs. This has stock cams? It would be interesting to see how the graph compares to other throttle body sizes tested on the same dyno.

 

That's pretty impressive

I really like the new wheels too

 

They really are a nice bit of kit. Looks quality. Hangs on to torque very well too doesn't it? Nice!

Gurds

 

Isn`t it just !

Stock engine apart from the ITB`s ?

 

Hi Nige hope your well?

Bone stock internals, Miltek/TSR ABF 4 branch and Jetex three box exhaust.

 

Here is how mine performed with a high mileage 16v and Toyotecwerke TB's.



Gurds

 

I`d be very interested in thoughts as to why PAB`s torque is so level, where Gurds` rise then falls. Both stock engines & cams, SAM and ITB`s.

The linear reduction in Torque over 6,000rpm seems pretty standard for these engines.

Shame I`m not closer, I`d love to get mine on the Garage Streamline Dyno !

 

I wonder if Eddie could puts this engine Dyno, mine, and Gurds onto the same graph for a comparison!

 

Different days, different ambient conditions.

What do you want to see?

You CAN compare the shapes of the different torque curves, but the numbers would only be comparable to a point.

 

But that`s my point. The Torque shapes are NOT the same shape ! This one is much flatter, without the usual rises and falls you see between 3500 and 4000 then 4750 and 5000. OK, Pab has them, but nowhere near the usual change in value.


Gurds and Tom`s are similar.

 

This is probably better off in a separate thread, Phil & Adi have done a really nice job & this discussion has the potential to clutter up this nice build thread.

If it goes on for too long, mods feel free to split it out into separate threads.


^ this one was when Tom's car was working well.

Without going into too much depth of detail, the variation comes in the form of:
Long runner ITBs, present on Gurds, & Tom's cars
Short runner ITBs present on Adi's car.
Variation of exhaust manifolds, these do make a difference to the torque shape,
^ who has what? I can't remember which one of you has a 4-1 / 4-2-1 etc.

So, although the ABF may be stock other than a ported head in some cases,
the combinations of ITB runner lengths, diameter, and exhaust manifold config = why they vary so.

 

It's all good fun working out what makes the variations I think! Ade's looks to make around 155lbft and mine (when healthy) and Gurd's made 160lbft+ my head is ported but I run a TSR exhaust manifold, I personally feel the extra grunt from the mid range torque is directly a result of the longer (tuned) inlet track length. I think it is good to try and prove that these things do matter and make a difference so that others can choose to benifit in the future if they go ITB.

 

Holy thread resurrection...

That's really interesting, the different torque profile is definitely down to inlet tract length IMO.

You can see that on smudge's and Gurd's plots the dips and peaks are much more pronounced. The peaks are where the wave reflections arrive just as the inlet valve opens to give a boost in VE. At other speeds there's lower pressure due to the wave reflections.

On PABs motor I think the runners are so short that the third order wave actions going on at over 7500rpm so the effect is lost.

 

Very tidy Mk2 you have there and a lovley colour too.

Great results from the mapping by Toyotec as usual!

 

can't believe you tracked it on Monday!

 

Yep good logical answer as ever, it really does interest me trying to work out the black magic that is airflow! I have posted some wave graphs onto Hotgolfs build thread if people want a nosy at what your on about.


It was really great to see this car on Monday, even better now it's on ITBs I only got a chance to catch up with PAB but I hope I will get a chance to meet the owner soon. Lovely car.

 

Yeah I know... Feel a bit guilty at talking Adi into putting it out there we were'nt trying too hard though... It's an honour to be involved with this car. I love it.

 

Lovely car indeed i'm jealous! Ever since owning mk2 2.0l valver on itb-s i wanted one again

That may just be my next N/A project/daily

 

This is one of my favorite golfs. I love the color. Wish I could have made it to curby to see it

 

Time for a bit of a resurrection again... new update coming soon keep watching....