Hello folks, After many hours reading here and there, I had to take the courage to finally start my project. Keep stumbling in this forum in Google search and have read many threads and posts, enough to cross big names and experts like Toyotec and Rubjonny over and over again. Long story short, I have an old mk1 GTI from 1981 with the old and out of order 1.6EG engine. Have given up on that engine and took the plunge last year and bought an ABF engine + loom and ECU from a 96 golf gti Plans are to use this engine along with stock gear train (020 FM gearbox) Since reading about nightmare that old ceramic fuse box like mine, went ahead and bought CE2 and entire car loom from 6k Seat ibiza (tdi90) If things were already messy, with all loom mixed just dont quite know where to start, to be honest. Initial plans where to completely strip the engine (since I don't know exact mileage and condition, maybe over 200k KMS) and give it a total overhaul with conrod bearings, rings, lifters ans gaskets. Gearbox may also need a rebuild, it has some leaks and 240k KMS If have a workshop with tools and experience in mechanical work, and I'm pretty handy with electrics, but wanted no keep this swap to a clean work with good reliability. My factory loom is in bad shape, with lots of splice anda extra wires, even in engine bay (lights loom, etc) What you guys think? My GTI is in the garage on hold for about 15 years now, and like to get it going again. Thanks in advance. Regards PS: sorry for some English splelling erros, I'm a litlle rusty. BTW, I live in Portugal
I've done a few MK1 CE2 conversions now, its pretty straight forward. the ibiza fusebox is in the middle of the car so you'll probably find a lot of the wiring is too long once moved to the factory spot on the left side, just some of the dash wires are a little short. Mostly it'll be a case of match up the wire colours, but you should confirm all the pins back at the fusebox side as sometimes the SEAT wiring colours differ. Once sorted the MK3 ABF engine loom will pretty much plug straight in, its up to you if you want to keep the mk3 headlight loom in there or strip that out and use the SEAT one. If you go with the mk3 stuff you keep most of it as is, just convert the slam panel section with mk1 plug ends. at the bulkhead side you'll note the mk3 loom goes thru 1 massive grommet, you can either make/enlarge a hole or you coudl do it how SEAT did on late toledo, they split the loom just before it enters the car so it could go thru the 2 smaller holes in the bulkhead most of the fusebox pins are available new, main exception is the mk1 clock connectors so hopefully the wires from your clocks are in good condition right back to the fusebox so you can salvage those out of the harness and crimp new pins on them to go into the CE2 fusebox. Have a look here, the mk1 cluster and ceramic fusebox pinouts are covered further down, mk2/3 ce2 near the top http://clubgti.com/showthread.php?219775
Thanks for the reply. If I get you correct I keep interior dash loom and rear loom wires and just cut wires near the fuse box, crimp new pins and plug them in the CE2? Is that correct?
you can go about it that way yes, if your mk1 loom is mostly good just replace any damaged stuff with donor wiring from the ibiza harness. Or you can bin all the mk1 wires and crimp new pins on the ibiza dash wiring to suit the mk1 switches. As I say the only issue with using ibiza wiring complete is you cant buy the mk1 clock pins, so those you would need to try to salvage at the very least (or grab another mk1 dash loom for donor pins, the later type clocks still have the same pins as the early mk1 so it makes no difference what year its from)
Thanks Rubjonny, Will take a better look the mk3 loom I got and post some pics... Still waiting on the Ibiza loom to arrive.
About engine and gearbox rebuild, any tips? I have the ABF flywheel but that wont match my pressure plate and clutch disc, right?
if you stick with the mk1 gearbox no you cant use the abf flywheel, keep it handy though in case you change to 02a/j box later on down the line for the ABF use a 1.8 type MK1/2 210mm flywheel, gti or carb makes no difference if you're using the ABF ECU (timing marks differ, but you dont need them on an abf ecu) then fit a 1.8 8v 210mm clutch kit to match the mk1 020 8v type gearbox, ideally sachs or LUK make. other than that straight fit, swap the mk1 mounts over replacing the rubbers where necessary and it all bolts right up
Hi, thanks for the reply Will do, since the box will be out. On the engine side, any advices? Haven't opened it yet, but from your experiences, major overhaul or some parts won't be needed? I was planing on conrod and crank bearings + thrust washers, piston rings, new gaskets, new lifters and valve stem seals Is it worth it, or some old parts can stay?
The latter is generally not required and I tend not to disturb., Inspection of the bores and one or two of the bearings will not hurt though. Leave alone, if within spec.
Morning all, First of all, sorry in advance for the long post... Last night went to the shop and burn some midnight oil, trying to make sense of my spaghetti. Ignore the shop mess, it's been busy.lol Divided it by areas, if easier for someone who can shed some light. This is my lump of metal anyway, GTI in the corner there... Also need to find a way to attach this somehow On to the wiring mess. As I said before, plans are to keep wiring loom from mk3 in engine bay and refit with mk1 plugs, since original wiring is bad... Please keep in mind my car and also donor car are LHD The entire bunch is flat on the ground, I've tryed my best to keep position it will be... I got some guesses but others not so much A- seems obvious, inside the car, to CE2 B- Scuttle, maybe wiper motor ?! C- Have no idea?! D- ECU and something else? E, F ang G- Not a clue H- Massive + small plug, no idea I- Engine connectors J- Positive battery terminal, starter wire cable, 2 ground terminals and something else? K- I'm assuming Left headlight L- Radiator fan?! M- Maybe right headlight N- Negative battery terminal Will post in detail after this what I can't make sense
The MK3 downpipe and manifold isnt easy to use in a mk1 shell, pretty different shape. if you buy a mk1 16v manifold need to get it adapted with lambda boss, be aware the ABF is taller so many mk1 16v manifolds dont fit very well. On my mk1 I used a mk2 16v manifold and had a custom downpipe off ebay, it needed a big kink to clear the gear linkage. Since the abf manifold sits lower this will make it even more tricky as it'll be closer to the linkage. you could drop it in and see, if its too much work try a mk2 type it sits a fair bit higher and may make live easier A: late mk3 loom, both the engien and headlight wiring is in there, note single fat bulkead grommet. you can either split the looms apart and run separate like they are on earlier Golf, or do what SEAT did with the toledo and split the 2 looms just before the bulkhead to fit thru the 2 smaller holes, or you can drill/enlarge a hole for the mk3 grommet B: wiper motor, heated washer jets, side repeater. MK2/3 wiper motor fits, nice upgrade C: brake fluid level, can fit mk3 cap on mk1 tank or swap earlier plug over, old plug uses 2.8mm latched spades easy to get D: ECU and side repeater E: lambda probe (keep) F: Inlet air temp or carbon canister, there should be 2 plugs here one for each usually. unless the carbon canister isnt required in your country? inl;et air temp is yellow./white and brown/blue, carbon canister is black/white and green/yellow G: aircon related H: fan control module I: big round plug for ecu loom, 3 pin plugs for crank sensor and knock sensors, 2 pin for reverse switch and aircon sensor, fat single pin for starter, thin single pin for alternator, main alternator -> starter cable there too J: battery -> starter cable, keep if possible its beefier than mk1 and probably better condition. plus has the nice mk3 terminal block K: looks like fan thermoswitch, bodged with spades, 2 pin for outside air temp on MFA clocks perhaps, will be red/white and brown/white if so. multi-pin is headlight plug L: radiator fan M: rest of the headlight loom plugs for the slam panel, if you keep this just need to chop plugs where needed and adapt to fit mk1 lamps N: battery -> chassis -> gearbox earth cable, again keep if you can
for the fan/aircon side iI'm assuming you dont want a/c, if not all the fan control module and associated a/c wiring can go. to get the fan working all you need on the mk3 harness is the red wire to thermoswitch for power, and the brown from the fan motor for earth. You can make your mk1 fan loom like it is on a mk2 golf, they have a 2 pin spade plug near the battery. crimp one of these on the mk3 wires above, then put the mk1 fan loom wires here, it depends what fan you want to use on that note, the mk3 tensioner wheel alternator setup can end up very close to the mk1 chassis leg, if you sweap the alternator and bracket for the earlier mk3 1.8-2.0 non-ac version which has the big spring under it this clears nicely. You will also need a non-ac waterpump to complete the conversion. I assume you dont want power steering either, if not thats dead easy just unbolt all the brackets on the bottom for it, the inner v-belt pulley comes out of the crank pulley as well
I have to correct you there John on hardware as you are also basing your comments on a non ABF RHD UK vehicle. While the Passat/Mk3 downpipe and cat is not suitable for MK1 vehicle packaging, the later tubular manifold is absolutely fine in a MK1, be it RHD or LHD. I have friends use this in tuned or track car applications and it is the right direction in terms of enhancing performance. A custom made downpipe MUST be made to suit the manifold. Fitting a lambda boss is a minor for an exhaust shop also.
thats handy to know I assumed since linkage is in the same place for the LHD mk1 it would be pretty tricky, since it was hard enough to get it all to clear on mine with the mk2 manifold...
You guys are legends Toyotec, Ive read your thread on tubular exhaust, will do my best to keep it and patch something up for the downpipe. Ive also seen John picture with the kinked downpipe, will try to build something that clears the shifter. I have mig and tig welder, its worth a shot I believe... John, will post the pics from the stuff I dont know for wiring later, but was wondering if you advise any place to get the mk1 terminals for dash switches and headlights, as well as CE2 terminals. Thanks
most of the dash switches on a mk1 use 6.3 or 2.8mm latched spade terminals, which are pretty much universal. For the CE2 fusebox and most of the ABF wiring loom plugs the medium sized ones are junior/power timer and the large ones are standard timer, again industry standard. The smaller ones in the ecu plug and the round plug are micro timer, quite easy to get hold of as well. I always try to use genuine TE/AMP make parts plus I've a few molex make spade terminals, the cheap ebay knock-offs sometimes dont fit or crimp quite as well. I shop for most of my terminals at farnell, also digikey and mouser have stocks of most stuff. it depends which part numbers you're looking for which site is the cheapest. those site ship worldwide but you may better prices at a more local electrical speicalist
I am not a legend. Just a bloke who can engineer his own stuff, has tested and tuned cars for lots on here with a willingness to share. Consider some proper gear links from someone like hotgolf while you are at it.
Yeah, I know what you mean. I'm a moderator in clubegolfpt.com and I've had my share in helping also, some part experience, some part knowledge. I've learned a lot too. Lately been away with work and less time to spend there, but seems the forum bug is biting again. Thanks anyway.
