26/08/17 *post 262* Toyotec's 'JENVEE'. The 6 speed era

Needs an airbox for a added performance Eddie!

 

In real world driving conditions, I agree there would be benefits for heat soak yes.

 

Looks like a strong contender. Nice wide power band from factory hardware.

Gurds

 

Cheers mate.
It is still needs to come up to the std of your old motor (174-181bhp), before I happy to step to the next stage

I may have found some clues why that might be so and I will update this thread a bit later, with a better analysis of the plot above.

 

... excellent work Eddie, that torque at those revs

You`re slowly `winning me over` to this `electronics` stuff lol

 

Torque-tastic. What's a standard ABF - about 135 lbft peak? If I'm remembering that correctly, JORAN has more torques (not talks) from about 2250-6250 rpm.

The way that power is being squeezed from ABFs on MSEFI is a game changer in trackday tuning, IMO - Why spend money on heads and cams until you've delivered the 20bhp and 30 lbft extra from MS? There's still scope to do that afterwards, but even then, I'd expect more real world gains than on stock management.

The question in my mind is - do you reckon that torque curve (or close to it) could be delivered from a properly remapped standard ABF dig ECU? I think plenty of people would want to buy that cal.

EDIT: Carfolio says 129 lbft, but a 'stock' figure from your dyno is probably more relevant.

 

Mike, "gads" Mk2 ABF on Digifant 3 is a completely standard ABF into Mk2 as per Eddie's how to ABF thread.



140lbft @4200 rpm

from thread:
http://www.clubgti.com/showthread.php?223623

 

Eddie has shown (multiple times) what a bespoke calibration can produce. Engines vary from one to the next in terms of output, & what is optimal for one, may not be optimal for the next. I believe this is why ebaY chips & generic flash remaps are milder/ more universal. Basically, it has to be safe to cover the variations.

 

Iirc didn't Rubjonny's Mk2 produce 149 torques on same dyno with ebay chip, interesting the 25 torques gain from proper optimisation on effectively the same hardware and I understand it was optimised on the road in a bit of a hurry. Excited to see what comes next for this engine! I think I'm sold!

 

Pity you are far away
I would let you drive it yourself and then you would really understand what is being demonstrated with all these plots

 

Hi Mike, I will attempt to answer your questions.

1. VW published the the ABF engine to achieve 133lbft@4600rpm and 150bhp@6200rpm.
I did conduct and exercise on several std vehicles, some which are reference vehicles for experiments, and found them to be very similar to VWs claims.

Ben posted an illustration of gad's car - very good reference vehicle used in many of my experiements and dyno days.

A comparison of an actual test on Sukh's 16v anniversary vs VWs claims, is shown in the illustration below.



From here

2. Why money on heads and cams? Because DIY SEMs or even affordable units like Emerald, DTA, OMEX etc were reserved for the hardcore with itbs etc or not available.
This was the way back in the mechanical days. Mechatronics adds an additional path for improvement, via adjustable electronic controls before hardware updates.
PS you mentioned heads and cams...well just watch and see what happens next I have only just started with this project.

3. You can deliver what the engine can do on any programable system, once you understand the strategy the controller works with. So yes I could do the same on a digifant 3.x system. Would I sell such a development to the public? No.
The MS system is just cheap and easy for me to produce and build, but you can do the same on a DTA/OMEX or Emerald as well. Then why buy an expensive SEM when a DIY unit can be calibrated to do the same, with ISCV, Datalogging etc?

4. The dyno plots and quantities at GS, are directly porportional to road acceleration traces, homolgated OEM vehicle plots, and a " reference number" for a certain feel (Gs) during road testing. However there are other brands that read very similar, whose data should not be discounted. All comes down to control software and user procedure in the end.
So for carfoilo data, do not where they got that from, looks more US 9A engine to me!

You are close enough... Say we forget all the data for a moment and you come and drive the thing, then you would understand even better.

 

Great update, nice torque curve, it would be good to compare this to my car, will it be at the RR day? I think it should.

 

Which one you want WOLF R or JORAN...lol

I could only drive one at a time!

 

Auction chip vendors do make claims of 210Nm (156lbft) and 171PS (169bhp) peak. I have never seen a plot of such a claim and a similar pull is something I am yet to see on GS' chassis rolls.

 

Yes it achieved 149lbft@4600rpm, on the day when Ben's early MS cal development achieved 157lbft@4500rpm and NATSABF with her stocker with 136lbft@4300rpm.

That was here, ~ 2 years ago

 

We did see the 166bhp/149 torque result but that seemed to be an anomoly, didn't it do 160bhp without chip on RJs ABF?

Eddie are you suggesting that a self optimisation is possible with the information we have? I'm not VERY interested and think we could do with a seperate thread on this!

 

This one, JORAN, nasp all the way, none of that wiz pop stuff!

 

Really appreciate the offer, thank you ... as of fairly recently I was in London four days a week, every week ... shame

Keep up the good work

 

Eddie, you might not sell an ABF digi 3.2 optimisation to the general public, but I sure would pay you to carry it out on my ABF. It has a healthy 145lbft and 161hp now, but the figures you have achieved on mild modding is superb. If this is available on the standard digi, ALOT of people would like to go down that route instead of paying out for expensive (for some) aftermarket management...

 

No it was not an anomoly but a valid exercise, using comparisons with a car that accelerated just like mine and one that was std.
Would have thought JORAN is an example of self optimisation