i can see your point, but at the same time you are only seeing one side of the argument this type of customisation is being performed in peoples garages all across america, whats to say we cant learn and adapt to keep the costs down here on our own cars
Yes i have and personaly i think its full of children trying to suck one another off by glueing monopoly money to their headlining or taking carfuly placed trainers in the picture with their car so they can have some on on there say "Wow thats totally sick man, but it needs to go lower". Or "thats so scene". What success exactly is that? Bolting a car together? Taking it to a show and have one say "oh that looks cool"
I can admire the metal fabbing skills, but seems such a waste to do it all to a mk3, and make it handle worse and go slower. His mates old variant things look great by comparison. I'm all for wheel tubbing, and awesome metalwork, just seems such a waste to do it to a **** car and make it ****ter as a result
Surely, if people want to spend the 000's that it takes to keep up with this sort of customisation, it's up to them. You can say that it will make the rest of the show field go home as they can't match it, but thats been happening for years. A cover feature car from 10-15 years ago wasn't a patch on what was needed last year as the "scene" has advanced so much. This is the next level in a way. When i first decided to buy a MK2 all those years ago, show cars were simple....over time, it's changed to the point of no return. I have no chance now of finishing my MK2 for reasonable figures and getting it noticed.......its gonna take serious funds......so you then build the car for YOURSELF and to the level that YOU want it to be at for the money that YOU want to spend.........which is the true ethos of car modifying IMO. People on here have track cars (some of which have had 000's spent on them) because thats what they want, some have massively modified cars because thats what they want.......if they are happy to throw potential mega-bucks into tubbed arches, that will never be seen, just to park in a field lower than anyone else, thats their perogative. Me???? I'll just build a car how I want it to be.
i don't understand the point of winning a 3.99 trophy after spending 911 money on an old golf. How does this make your life worthwhile? sure you can make your car look and go better and take pride in it, but at some point it becomes just daft
Agree, but it boils down to maintaining scene presence. The track car '000s argument is entirely valid. Modifications are governed by the clock and little else. If tubbing / moving chassis parts of suspension around was of benefit, people would do it, subject to cost, but notably no one does. It is too complicated and too expensive to entertain, and getting it wrong doesn't bear thinking about: Spend X, go slower - that'll hurt. It also means the cars could not be used in motorsport easily, so it holds everyone back (a good thing). In the show scene, it really is about getting low, and having stance, and it seems there is little to hold anyone back, apart from their vision and their wallets. As prof said, at some point, as a result, it just becomes daft.
That MK3 isn't road legal 'yet', but from what i've read the intention is that it will be. I cant imagine it cost a lot to do, they are company who did all the work inhouase, probably had all the beetle stuff laying about and a Mk3 is pennies. When its done it will be a hell of an advertisement for their workshop/business.
Need I ask what it was doing on the road!! http://www.clubgti.com/forum/showthread.php?t=199713&page=2
ok structural mods have been going on for years in the vw track/drag scene...trendy tramps mk2, the lad with the 5 pot adui running gear....it's all good. I've modded the structure of my mk1 by welding mk2/3 bits in and on. No scene points required in this camp though. As mk1/2's run out we will start to make our own......i'd love a carbon fibre mk1 on a tubular chasiis cage arrangement!!! Don't deter this evolution....the scene will come and go.....Jap influence one year retro the next....aircooled the next. There have always been $$$$ cars.....look at the hot rods it's just come mains stream to the largest car manufacturer in the world VW. Cut my teeth on aircooled stuff...not fast enough for me though and i like a good heater!
I agree.....but it's personal choice surely? I couldn't justify it myself, but then, nor could i justify thousands on a track toy. It's not what i want to do, but it's what THEY want to do. Someone chooses to spend 000's on a track car for a faster time to beat the next person, second place wants more and has to spend more money to get it, and it snowballs. Someone wants a showcar to stand out from the sea of euro'd MK2's, the spend the money and do it. The next person wants to beat that, they have to spend more, and again......it snowballs. IMO it's exactly the same, it's just some want to spend that money to go fast, some want to spend it to stand out in a sea of show cars.
True enough. My only fear is there are no limits now as to what the show scene is going to do with bodyshells. With a track car, there are limits: it's an understood list of: cage, sound deadening out, underseal off, spare brackets off. Seam weld if you're going mad. There isn't a snowball with endless momentum - that's it, job done. Where will the show-shell mods end? I'm just staggered to look back and think I showed my old Jetta at Inters in 1992.
At first i thought the above post was the best post of this thread! then i read the one below no more needs to be said.
Hobby/interest/aims in life. Everyone is different. I can't understand football.....if they didn't kick the ball from that centre spot in the first place, they wouldn't have to run around trying to stop it going in their net, wouldn't have hooligans and would save a lot of money.......but to some people it's the most important thing in life. If everyone was the same, the world would be a bloody boring place......it's guys like these that bring different elements to the VAG scene. It may mean that others are willing to spend more money to beat it ,it may mean that the car goes down in history as a completely original, groundbreaking car that will never be seen again. There's one thing to prove though......it's made this thread happen, so it's got some coverage!
I'm not knocking car modding at all, just the forms where they make the original car worse. the Pro touring scene in the states is a huge business now, but the guys are building lowered and wheeltubbed 68 camaros/ dodge chargers etc that'll do 200mph, 10 second quarters and keep up with ferraris at laguna seca. There are plenty of show cars, but most of them also get autocrossed and are modified to be better than the original product.
o.p has missed the point! basically if its not racing its not right! and i wonder why i dont talk much on here? cgti is getting worse and this is why other forums keep cropping up! o.p and his chums only appriciate motorsport dubs on their site! none of this custom rubbish! go with the flow buddy! it brings new blood to the scene and then they find out about other ideas. swings and round-abouts! if you dont like somthing go find summat you do like! plenty in the dub scene i dont like but i dont slate it!
OP is concerned for the wallets of those involved, as he knows how expensive it can all become. OP wrote Mk2 Golf GTI race regulations to kerb costs. Hence it's cheap and the regs are tight. Not looking for sole credit by any stretch, but it all helps keep people's enthusiasm as they know what they're working to - and the limits. Cue full grids with reserves. Let me know when you've got a Mk2 Golf tubbed for 2,500, ready to win show trophies and we'll talk. Until then, you miss the point.
I used to get annoyed at seeing people waste time and money on stuff I wasn't into or didn't understand, even to the point of trolling the forums and hassling them. now i just sit back and laugh, and tet them get on with it. No doubt there will be many many people in the vw world and beyond who think i am completely wasting my time going as far as i am with a corrado that will never be raced competitively. or the fact that I am currently undertaking modifications to reduce the rear camber...some of the ed38 guys would die for 6 degrees of negative at the back As for "show cars", my old mk2 won best watercooled at donny custom and sports car show 2 years running, and joint runner up in the concours at gti international. looking back at how it was, it wouldn't have been anywhere near the top 100 cars on display at edition 38 this year. I'm actually glad i got slightly bored of the show scene and got into the track and drag stuff instead, not that it's been any easier, or cheaper for that matter....but i know i will get far more pleasure out of driving it than i will from parking it in a field and polishing it. and that's what's important, if it makes you happy, then do it...
think you miss the point, the post was tongue in cheek you can't get a lower, hence bring a spade to dig your car in.
i dont care if you dont like the golf, but dont call my work ****. the steering is sraight off the doner type3 and VW never had any probs with them. people have been building beachbuggies for years mines metal with a roof. i love the way it sits, its not on air and won't be. the van is also mine and drive that as low as the road will let me. i built the bras and we can drive that how we like even hit the floor if we want i also built the square, when we had it it didn't run air the new owner had us make an air system for so he could take it home to Ireland and do many euro shows with us. some poeple like to go fast, some poeple like concours, i like to be low. fur q
i'm with Phatty on this one too ! Show Cars ? or Go Cars ? For me its got to be Go Cars i.e ones that are raced and driven Hard Probably why of stopped buying all the mags a long time ago too.
