The 16V G60 thread.

Got a merc sprinter one for now, I know it will require some fetling of the front crossmember but it is thinner than most of the aftermarket coolers.


An RS2 style intercooler will allow you to fit a connection at each end of the intercooler so I am hoping that I can get away the Merc one. (John Mitchell of JMR has his setup like that)


Think your best bet is to get the engine ready and look at the IC plumbing when thats all in place - thats my current plan.

 

For the cooant flange, I used the BBM spacer and single holed flange for fitting the G60 blue temp sender on the side of the head. I`ve kept the rear cast G60 bracket (made a blockoff plate) and modified a core plug for the block breather.

The rad sits to the left by about an inch over the original fitting and I bought another 16v rad pipe, fitted it backwards and it clears the G60 (moved the dipstick pipe out of the way).

I`ve seen the custom front coolant flange BBM made for the 16v block but was never supplied one..

 

Right just I can make sure this is clear in my head


You fit the blue water temp sensor that is required to get digipants working properly on the side of the head under the dizzy using the BBM spacer and a single outlet with a sensor hole in it as supplied by BBM.


For the front coolant flange you used a standard 16v one?


I am therefore assuming that for the water temp gauge in the car you use one of the existing KR block sendors that would have originally been used as part of the idle stab valve setup?


I have also retained the rear charger bracket and made up a spacer plate to act as a seal. Instead of moving the dipstick I have just ground a bit away from the bracket to get it to fit.

 

All seems fine, you need to vent the circular hole in the block where the breather box fitted, I used a core plug with a hose fitting welded on an angle to miss the coolant pipe.

As for the front flange, I`ve gotten away with using the stock one but even after bending the oil dipstick housing is pretty close..

 

I was going to see if I could get hold of bush with threaded section to accomodate the knock sensor in where the 6v breather assembly normally sits in the block.


I think that is where it goes on the PG block as well.

 

I can have a front-mount FMIC made for me that is of similar dimensions to the Rallye one, but with horizontal tanks and vertical core tubes. Hence the ports could be pretty much anywhere (I suppose!). Like they could both be at the far end opposite the charger, or maybe even have the outlet port at the far end to suit the TB, but the inlet port kind of in the middle somewhere to suit the charger outlet, know what I mean?

Keith, having obviously built up your engine entirely and of course having the same constraints as I will in terms of alternator position etc, do you have any thoughts about where you would ideally have the inlet and outlet ports situated?

 

Been chatting to a guy who has been running a 16v 60 conversion for a few years now and thought you guys might want this info. (Well trev anyway as Keith already has his motor in)


The recommendation was to keep the 16v crankcase vent system that sits on the block instead of the rear charger bracket. I was told that it is not worth modding the rear charger bracket to breath as it will still throw oil all over the shot at high RPM.


Also it was recommended to fit a oil return line to sump as part of a catch tank setup.


I would be interested to know your experiences of crankcase oil venting problems or not at high revs Keith.

 

Yandards, many thanks for the info. Always useful to hear this kind of advice from people who are already running this engine. Keith, of course, is also a mine of info!

Regarding the oil return line to the sump, the sump that BBM supplied has an oil line connector - is it this that you're referring to? Or is that intended for the S/C oil return? I was intending to run a Pitstop separate oil system anyhow, so that sump connection could be used for a catch system right?

Noted about the vent system. I know that some people have concern about not using the rear charger bracket though. But isn't there a different kind of rear charger bracket that was used on some engines? I remember someone describing a kind of 'squashed tube' bracket... sure it was Pigbladder or someone who mentioned this.

I've got some new pics of my setup I can post later. Nothing exciting really - was taking some pics of the supercharger area to start designing my FMIC. I reckon there's plenty of room to run an inlet hose on the supercharger side after all, so will abandon the idea of having a twin pass one made up.

 

Hello Trev, you`re in a better position than me to eye up the intercooler really with the front of the car off, having said that there looks like plenty of room in front of the alt, I`ll have to have another look at the weekend.

My catch can retuns to the sump, BBM sump has 2 holes one for the G return and the other is plugged, if you plan on using the plugged one at any point un-do it before the engine goes in the car because I had a mare removing it on mine (had to drill the fecker out )

I had oil vent problems with high revs, and quite a few others do as well, I think not venting the case as well as cam-cover would be a mistake personally.

To use the cast bracket I made a steel plate up to seal the vent hole, not a big job, the core plug mod for the block breather was more time consuming, but worth it?

One thing about Digi1, it ruined my engine, OK to get it running to start with but MS or similar would be a good investment (and some time to tune it). Don`t know if Digi was confused by the cams?

 

What happened with the engine when you ran Digifant then Keith? I personally intend to just chuck MS in straight away.

Yes agree about there potentially being enough room in front of the alternator to route the inlet there. I was thinking of having an inlet port made on the FMIC that bends 90 degree so that the pipe goes in sideways if that makes sense. I'll make up a cardboard model or something to see how it'll fit!
Edited by: Trev16v

 

Car ran too rich until closed loop kicked in (reguardless of CO-pot settings), ran lean on the BBM chip under any kind of boost and digilag`s a female dog.. I think the idle control was it`s only saviour and I`ve just about cracked that so it`s a null point.

Tried many different injector, fuel pressure settings etc and it never ran right.

 

I was going to use the second oil return on the BBM supplied sump for the catch tank return line, so thanks for the info that one of them is sealed!!


This is a good link to an article that was posted on the CF a while ago about engine breathing:


http://www.fusionfabrication.fsnet.co.uk/breatherdesign.htm


Interesting info about your breathing mods Keith, I have already made up a spacer plate to fit between the standard rear charger bracket and the block but will be switching back to the standard 16v block breather instead. Trev the metal bar you are talking about is designed to be fitted onto the bottom of the block and then to the charger - if you ETKA it is part no: 037 145 535, you will also need part no: 037 145 539B - intermediate plate. You can find this in the corrado section maingroup 1, section 45 illustration 48-00.


My ideal solution for a block breather would be to get a custom part made that combines both the 16v block breather assembly and has the section required to fix to the rear of the charger.


Interesting to hear about your Digi problems Keith, I too am not expecting the BBM chip to run well out of the box, despite a standard charger, I have ported/polished every other major component in the intake/exhaust system of the engine as well as fitting a cut down S2 manifold. I do expect it to sort itself out with a good custom mapping session though, chipwizzards seem to come highly recommended by the guys running crazy power G60's.


I would be interested to see how you get on with the separate oil supply to the charger Trev, I looked into it as I intend to get my redline set to around 8k during the remap, so was worried about the oil pump kicking out too much pressure and blowing charger oil seals on a regular basis.


How did you vent your cam cover Keith?

 

Got some custom fittings from thinkauto to vent the cam cover (beetle breather was a bit poor).

Don`t go to small with the G pulley, I`ve melted the main oil seal lips on mine with a 65mm and 7k rpm (could have been worse!), I`d say the stock 78 is your best bet at 8k rpm..

 

Crikey!


Think you can get get uprated oil seals from here though:


http://www.bar-tek-tuning.de/lshop,showrub,1140249559-6406,e ,1140249564-6408,g-lader.1080321201,,,,.htm

 

Darren`s sorting me an uprated set out at G-Werks, going down to a 68 and see how it goes..

Trackday at Donnington on the 65mm f**ked it I think

 

How are you fairing on the car then Trev, are you making a few alterations ?

 

Erm.

*Cough*

Nothing drastic.

 

Hello Trev, have you sorted an IC yet? I`ve gone all in for an air/water chargecooler so if you haven`t bought one yet hang-fire and I`ll post some readings up when mine`s done (a couple of weeks time).

 

That would be really great Keith. With regards to the FMIC I only got as far as making up the required pipework to route to my custom IC so that I could determine its port locations, but I haven't got round to ordering it. I've not spent much time on the engine and still not even got it running N/A! Must get my fuel hoses sorted out so that I can at least fire it up and run it in without the charger. I get bored of cranking it by hand ever week to stop it seizing up...

No, what I'm doing at the moment is a lot of work on the chassis. I've decided to carry out a rather bonkers extension to the project...

 

You going 4wd? just sent my G60 back to G-werks, managed to knacker the oil seals doing a trackday with the 65mm (not recomended!).